Cutting brakes

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woody said:
A "real" air assist pump is vital for good cutting brakes....my FToy worked but had the same symptoms you describe. The new buggy is 10x better since they were air-bled.
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Did you go air vacuum or air pressure to bleed? I just ordered a pressure bleeder. Should be here tonight.
 
Well I pressure bled them tonight. Sitting in the shop making sputter pretend noises and testing them sitting still - my imagination says they feel stiffer and it doesn't seem like pushing on the cutter brake pushes back against the brake pedal as much. Since the car is on the hoist it getting prepped for an out of state run next week I won't actually get a chance to test them till this weekend. Crossing fingers.........
 
Test drive a success. Pressure bleeder lived up to its reputation. Brakes are much better and I don't feel as much push back from the cutter to the brake pedal. In 3wd (rear unlocked) I can crank the wheel, give it gas, stab the cutter and it actually jacks the suspension up. Same in reverse. I only did a quarter mile down the road and it seemed encouraging.

Off to Harlan next weekend so I'll have real world feedback after. :)
 
I ordered a Motive pressure system from Summit Racing last week that is supposed to fit the Girling-type cap on my Wilwood reservoir....claimed ship date was January.

Delivered today....new pads delivered Friday....testing the setup shortly :)

Good to know it worked!! I already pressure bled mine, but have some "tweaks" to make to the line setup, so a re-bleed is due.
 
I bought this Motive one. I have the dual Wilwood reservoirs. The chains and J-screws didn't hold pressure so I ended up using C-clamps. I spent more time getting it figured out than what it took to actually bleed all 4 calipers. I probably bled about a cup out of each one. Lots of tiny bubbles came out.

Huh - for whatever reason the link won't load.


Motive Products 105 Brake System Power Bleeder
 
pennsylvaniaboy said:
If you could pick between cutting brakes and rear steer what would you guys choose?
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both :)

Cutting brakes is nothing more than a rear selectable locker, plus $200ish in additional plumbing and the cutting brake levers. Rear steer is $$$$$.

I will say, I rely on my cutters much less now that I have rear steer, but both are useful tools depending on the circumstances.
 
woody said:
both :)

Cutting brakes is nothing more than a rear selectable locker, plus $200ish in additional plumbing and the cutting brake levers. Rear steer is $$$$$.

I will say, I rely on my cutters much less now that I have rear steer, but both are useful tools depending on the circumstances.
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yeh, planning a new buggy....debating on selectable locker drag axle with cutting brakes....or rear stear....there is a significant price difference tho
 
pennsylvaniaboy said:
yeh, planning a new buggy....debating on selectable locker drag axle with cutting brakes....or rear stear....there is a significant price difference tho
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I started planning mine about a year ago....and ended up all in. My original plan was "bulletproof" D60/D70's and front/rear steering...the $$ change to portals was negligible.

For a "trail" rig, portal JHF 9's with the D60 birfs and 45 degree steering is about as bulletproof as you can get at this point. I watched rigs at SuperCrawl this past weekend at 45 degrees do some ridiculous stuff without breaking...
 
Ya, my problem is justifying the extra expense when I have a well built, nice rig. Spending north of $5K on rear steer when we have a kitchen to remodel veers too far away from "happy wife = happy life" for me. I run with 3 RS rigs and they definitely make me want it. Oh well. LOL
 
woody said:
I started planning mine about a year ago....and ended up all in. My original plan was "bulletproof" D60/D70's and front/rear steering...the $$ change to portals was negligible.

For a "trail" rig, portal JHF 9's with the D60 birfs and 45 degree steering is about as bulletproof as you can get at this point. I watched rigs at SuperCrawl this past weekend at 45 degrees do some ridiculous stuff without breaking...
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If I do rear steer it will be '05+ super duty 60s front and back with 1550 joints. I can get the complete axles for around $350 which makes tehm tempting but I can build a elocker rear sterling for less than the brakes and ram on a steering axle.
 
Wanted to add to this thread as I struggled for 3 solid days with a harbor freight bleeder that literally sucked.

I ordered a mityvac on Amazon but returned it when I found these for 1/3 the cost.

Got it on Friday and blend the brakes in 30 min


agm-products.com

Brake Pressure Bleeder

BONUS- FREE Catch Bottle, Syringe and Filler Cap Wrench NOTE- Reservoir Adapter Cap NOT Included. Sold separately. Tired of waiting for a friend to stop by to bleed your brake, or getting in an argument with your significant other over how to bleed brakes? Or the worst, running the reservoir...
agm-products.com agm-products.com
 
Mine seem to be getting worse again. Time to pressure bleed them again. I'm tempted to ditch the plastic lines too.
 
whiterhino said:
Mine seem to be getting worse again. Time to pressure bleed them again. I'm tempted to ditch the plastic lines too.
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I’m definitely going hard lines in the future

Spoke with SHO and they switched Steve’s new buggy and said it made a huge difference in the pedal
 
Thank you for the help MAC33. I did buy the AGM bleeder and it’s works great. I have a 3/4” wilwood single master cylinder with a remote reservoir that I got from SHO. Jamar cutting brakes on the rear only. All 4 piston wilwood calipers and plastic lines. Brakes work great.
Remember to buy a second lid for reservoir that is where you force the oil in at 15psi
 
whiterhino said:
So you are not in the must have hard line vs plastic camp?
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I would believe Steve Nantz 💯. You will need flex joints at all the pivot points and mounting tabs which is a lot of connections. This buggy came with plastic lines and brakes were good. This pic is an aluminum manifold (internet) that has two 1/4” and four 1/8 npt ports. I added a brake light switch

4A846F19-B069-4D18-B4BD-7C451ACFCA3A.webp
 
Bleeding procedure (from Hardline Crawlers, identical to what's on P4x4)

  1. Press down once on the brake pedal
  2. Pull and hold the cutting brake lever
  3. Purge the air from the caliper
  4. Close the bleeder while still holding the cutting brake
  5. Release the pedal but not the cutting brake
  6. Slowly pump the pedal, allowing the cutting brake to return with hand pressure against it until the pedal pumping has pushed the cutting brake handle back to neutral
  7. Repeat the process
S L O W L Y
 
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First time setting up cutting brakes, Through my conversations I was told that with the set-up I have (Toyota axles with Toyota disc brakes all the way around trail gear rear conversion). Use a 2-5psi residual valve for the rears as it keeps that pressure there so when the cutting lever is pulled you have a little pressure already there. I have the valve but have not installed yet. Anyone have any experience or input on doing this??
 
Dirtbag1 said:
First time setting up cutting brakes, Through my conversations I was told that with the set-up I have (Toyota axles with Toyota disc brakes all the way around trail gear rear conversion). Use a 2-5psi residual valve for the rears as it keeps that pressure there so when the cutting lever is pulled you have a little pressure already there. I have the valve but have not installed yet. Anyone have any experience or input on doing this??
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I have Jammar cutting brakes. I need to step on the foot pedal to preload the cutting brake or it doesn’t do much. I have a tiny residual valves on front and back on JHF portals with wilwood four piston calipers
 
Unless someone has run all 3 on the same rig to test, then no clue for sure. EMPI is the budget version. They have worked for me on two different rigs.
 
How big are these? debating if I can fit a side by side one or if I needed the over under push pull

any one have some basis sizes?

empi-cnc-dual-handle-upright-steering-brake-hand-brake-staging-brake-cutting-brake-turning-br...webp


empi-cnc-single-handle-upright-steering-brake-hand-brake-staging-brake-cutting-brake-turning-...webp


empi-cnc-single-handle-angled-steering-brake-hand-brake-staging-brake-cutting-brake-turning-b...webp


empi-cnc-dual-handle-angled-steering-brake-hand-brake-staging-brake-cutting-brake-turning-brake.webp
 
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